Host (Ivaylo Lakov): Good evening! You are watching "The World is Business" on Bloomberg TV Bulgaria. I am Ivaylo Lakov, and my guest tonight is Maxim Behar – founder and director of M3 Communications Group. He has been involved in communications for many years, which will be the topic of our conversation today. Let's talk a bit about communications and how information is shared from one place to another – from the idea of the Bulgarian brand to the women's boxing competition at the Olympics. Welcome, Maxim. Thank you for joining me!

Maxim Behar: Good evening!

Host: I know you have been working to promote Bulgaria as an investment destination for years. I don't know if you have any involvement with "Webit" or not, but I know that you hold regular meetings with the CEOs of large foreign companies in Bulgaria and consistently discuss what needs to be done and how, what looks good and what doesn't. Tell me about these meetings with the CEOs and what feedback you receive from them.

Maxim: This is an idea I started to execute this year. We invite 10 people for lunch, called "CEO only," and we discuss, share opinions, and debate there. The lunch is exclusively for CEOs, so we can all talk on the same level. As you said, the idea of the Bulgarian brand has been around for 20-25 years and, unfortunately, remains just that – an idea. And it is often discussed because, in my opinion, Bulgaria continues to be a well-kept secret. I travel a lot worldwide, and borders are now much more open with many other countries, especially overseas. It's not a big priority for us to promote Bulgaria overseas in North America or Latin America. But even in Europe, there is not much clarity when you mention Bulgaria. No one knows that we have the lowest taxes in Europe or that Sofia is a highly safe city.

Host: Why is that? How do you explain it? Why do we stick to symbols like the yogurt and the rose, as if there is nothing more to Bulgaria?

Maxim: Because successive groups of politicians have wanted to do something over the past 10 years but don't know how to. In the previous caretaker government – that of Prime Minister Nikolai Denkov, I had 10-15 meetings with different ministers at various levels, and everyone found my ideas great. Ultimately, nothing happened because the Bulgarian branding didn't interest anyone in this puddle where we exchanged epithets and quarreled. Most importantly, we must succeed in promoting Bulgaria as a good and decent country and Bulgarians as intelligent people with a European mindset. No politician would take on this task because they don't understand it. When a minister from the last regular government invited me to a meeting, he told me about the "Brand Bulgaria" initiative and that its working group consists of ministers. And I wondered, what does the Minister of Environment or Agriculture understand about branding, communications, or presentation? Instead of ministers, communication and branding professionals from Bulgaria and abroad should be invited to a large meeting to yield results. Also, Bulgaria doesn't have a logo.

Host: People will immediately counter you on that – there is one with a rose that looks more like something else.

Maxim: That can't be a logo. Bulgaria doesn't have a message or slogan. There is no sentence that describes Bulgaria in terms of what it is. If you remember, 20 years ago, my partner, the governor of Nevada, Bob Miller, and I made a series of conferences called "Bulgaria – Dream Area." I really liked "Bulgaria – Dream Area" because it rhymes and is easy to remember, and Bulgaria really is a dream area. We translated it as "Bulgaria – the land of dreams." We wanted it, dreamed a lot, and hosted seven consecutive conferences from 2001 to 2004 before we decided to stop. At one of them, in 2002, we even had a live connection with President Bill Clinton. At that time, there were no Zoom or fast communication tools, yet the American President connected live – we made history. After that, starting with Ex-Prime Minister Boyko Borissov's first cabinet, I started proposing to each government to sell them the "Bulgaria – Dream Area" brand, which is registered internationally and in which I have invested money, for 1 euro. All governments found my ideas interesting. I told them that they don't have to use it, and I am giving it to the state for 1 euro, but if they have something better, they can put it on the table or hold an international contest for the Bulgarian branding strategy. The problem with Bulgaria is that although there is no longer a negative perception of it, there is a lack of clarity around the country.

Host: There isn't a good perception either.

Maxim: Yes, because there isn't enough information about it. And I continue to claim that of all Eastern European countries, Bulgaria is the only one where we still have many niches for business. This is not Poland, the Czech Republic, Slovenia, or Hungary, where you find it difficult to do business because the market is full. Here, you can come with 200-300 thousand euros and start a business, find the best niche, work 24/7 like everywhere else, and succeed. I know dozens of successful foreigners. Something revolutionary must happen after so many years. Exactly 30 years ago, I organized the first investment conference in Bulgaria called "Doing Business in Bulgaria." I think you were working at the Bulgarian National Television at the time and remember "Doing Business in Bulgaria" in '94. In '98, I founded the Bulgarian Investment Forum and was the executive director, along with Ilian Vassilev and Krasen Stanchev. Four thousand people from all over the world paid to attend the Forum at the National Palace of Culture. The state did not give a penny to the Bulgarian Investment Forum, which probably continues to this day because many forums happened afterward. These were exceptionally well-organized and purposeful efforts to "sell" Bulgaria to the world in the best sense of the word – to show that it's an excellent place for investment. Sofia is a very safe city, and no one knows that. If someone walks through Alexanderplatz in Berlin or any other big European city, they will see that there are extremely risky areas, unclean at that, but not in Sofia. With my friends Ivan and Andrey, who are doing the wonderful initiative "Bulgaria Wants You," we want nothing from the state except for it not to interfere with our work to promote Bulgaria abroad. Believe me, there is no greater priority right now than this. No state law is more important than the world knowing that Bulgaria is a good country.

Host: Why doesn't this happen at the administration and government level, in your opinion? Is it because of money, or who will take the commissions?

Maxim: No. I don't even want to imagine it's because of some commissions, although these are quite large sums of money involved. There is simply no good strategy, plan, or organization stating the responsible people, their tasks, and their deadlines.

Host: Maxim, tell me what you hear in political communication. Once again, we are on the verge of elections. We see some efforts related to the third mandate. Apparently, negotiations are being held in front of people, but it is not clear what's going on.

Maxim: There will probably be elections again.

Host: In this situation, there is a total communication breakdown from the political class to the so-called electorate, who are becoming increasingly skeptical and uninterested. This is a direct blow to the fundamental democratic principles. Bulgarian people feel completely isolated and disconnected from political processes.

Maxim: In a sense, voters have always been isolated. Now, an exceptionally large number of faceless subjects have appeared on the political scene – party leaders who make decisions, but if you meet them on the street, you might not recognize them at all. There is a total collapse of leadership abilities among many politicians, not only in Bulgaria but in many other countries. The lack of leadership distances the voters from those they vote for. Additionally, there is a great disappointment because there are no charismatic people. Ultimately, this is part of communication. When you speak, only 7% is the speech, and 93% are the gestures, body language, tone, eye contact, and all other elements. No one understands this, however.

Host: But the message is also essential.

Maxim: The message is essential, but how you deliver it is just as important. There are politicians who occasionally talk about the market economy, but so vaguely that no one understands them. Many of them use their television presence to settle scores with others, especially on morning shows on some TV channels. The Bulgarian Socialist Party, for example, only communicate with one another through TV, and occasionally, someone says something else.

Host: Did you understand what is happening in the Movement for Rights and Freedoms from what people say on TV?

Maxim: No. Probably, someone is fighting for power or to take someone's place. But there are no political or economic messages, commitment to voters or a strategy. My dream is to see someone like post-communist Poland's first Finance Minister, Leszek Balcerowicz, in Bulgaria. He is a conservative economist who, in the early '90s, led Poland out of a giant economic crisis and the empty stores, among which we lived. I wish to see a conservative, very pragmatic economist who is not interested in politics show the situation in Bulgaria, including branding and communication, and what changes need to be made. If I were the Minister of Innovation, I would give 50 or 100 thousand euros interest-free loans to every startup company that shows me a business plan. Maybe I would even give the money as a gift to some of them. Why? Half of them won't repay it or will go bankrupt. But the other half will succeed, and those will be real businesses that employ people, provide good jobs, and succeed on a global level. No one will start a company only to grow tomatoes or potatoes. Everyone will establish a startup for something they can sell outside Bulgaria in the free market. I am sharing my broad ideas, but there are probably economists who can push these ideas if they have the proper political support. And here is the big drama - the political system doesn't work, affecting branding and communication.

Host: When you say something like that, it's also a blow to democracy because someone will immediately think of making Bulgaria a presidential republic, which is not good.

Maxim: No, it's not good, of course. I would say, let's try to introduce information technology into the management of politics. There are many experts to say how this can happen. However, the big problem in elections and the political system, which cannot be changed at this stage, is that there needs to be control over promises. Everyone travels around Bulgaria and promises everything – raising pensions, salaries, etc. They promise a 2% budget deficit, but when they come to power, it becomes 5%. In other words, there is no control over promises. In business, this is impossible to happen. If a manager promises something to his employees but doesn't deliver, either the employees leave in 2 months, or more likely, the manager. Information technology should be introduced to control politicians' promises. Whoever promised something and didn't deliver in 3 months, when he goes to work and tries to enter with his card, it should show that he is fired – the computer system should block his card. It seems like a utopia, but one day, it will happen. Think about it, the whole world is now different.

Host: It makes me think. The prime minister appoints and fires a minister. The prime minister proposes them and there is a vote, and so on. Indeed, this could be implemented. But this is part of the function of e-government. Information technology harnessed in government and administration work is e-government. Since I have been working as a journalist, we have been trying to make an e-government. Where is it, Mr. Behar?

Maxim: It's simple—we haven't done it. There is no direct flight between Sofia and Tallinn, Estonia, but you can fly to Tallinn from somewhere, probably Warsaw or Istanbul. A minister could get on the plane and spend a week there to see what the Estonian people have done with their e-government.

Host: They know very well but don't want to do it because that would mean significant administrative cuts and unpopular measures, likely associated with subsequent election loss.

Maxim: We have talked in this studio about how a country could be governed as a business corporation.

Host: There was a minister who tried to manage their ministry that way but was set up and resigned.

Maxim: If a corporation is losing money or influence, branding, or sales, most likely, it will be restructured, or either the CEO or the board will change. It's true that the state also has other responsibilities – defense, national security, and foreign policy. The state should handle these three things but not interfere in anything else. Quite the opposite – it should give opportunities to the private sector. In the most transparent way possible, it should prove that the private sector makes money, pays taxes, and provides good salaries. I know this is a long topic, but one day this should happen. Otherwise, no one will vote or be interested in who is in power. Not to mention that no matter how much we vote, we haven't had a government in a long time, and probably won't have soon. Within the last 2 weeks, I spoke with many investors who said they are waiting for the regular government to invest. They don't know if they sign an agreement or a contract now, and the interim government commits, and the regular government won't reject it afterward.

Host: It is even more likely to reject it.

Maxim: A person who invests 50-100 thousand leva is not a state problem – it's the investor's concern. But a person who invests 200 million concerns Bulgaria and our government. We must give such people the best possible conditions because apart from the money, investment projects, and taxes, these companies bring culture to Bulgaria and their know-how of working by the standards of an international company from a prosperous country. For Bulgaria, foreign investments are now the number one priority and requirement. We discussed this with you 25-30 years ago, but now the world is different. We have ongoing wars and economic crises, and we need to be competitive because the competition is now immensely greater. Bulgaria is a much more developed country and has better living standards. People receive much better salaries and prices are becoming European. Bulgaria is an entirely different country and much better than during our conversations 25-30 years ago. And now we must use these improvements to attract big investors with large projects.

Host: Maybe we should organize a big sports event to attract attention.

Maxim: I don't believe a sports event will attract attention. Dr. Plamen Rusev, the founder of "Webit," is a good friend of mine, but I don't believe an IT or technology event can attract attention either. To me, it is time for a very good promotion campaign for Bulgaria abroad. These are the so-called "roadshows," and participation in major conferences.

Host: How much money do you think should be invested in a roadshow?

Maxim: They are inexpensive – 10 people go to Chicago, San Francisco, or London.

Host: But you need to make noise for people to come to this roadshow.

Maxim: People will come when good investment prospects and opportunities to make money are presented to them. Everyone will come if offered to invest 250 million without paying taxes for 5 years in exchange for hiring 400 Bulgarian people for this project. The state will almost not benefit from the taxes as they are very low. However, when an entrepreneur invests the money and creates production, this will require original ideas and flexible policies. We can't just invite 10 companies to a Bulgarian embassy somewhere and tell them how good Bulgaria is; we need to be specific.

 

Host: The problem is that there is no continuity. One cabinet negotiates something, and when it falls after 5 months, the caretaker cabinet rejects half of the agreements. Then, a new government rejects what the caretaker cabinet agreed on. People are losing trust as there is no sustainability of relations.

Maxim: I was very surprised by the words of the Prime Minister Dimitar Glavchev that the wonderful initiative "Brand Bulgaria," which Maria Gabriel had started, was halted. I spoke with her several times about it, and suddenly, a caretaker government came and stopped it. How is that possible? There is nothing more important than the Brand Bulgaria project. If something is wrong inside the organization –questionable financing, for example – let them see and review it but continue the initiative. I cannot imagine Bulgaria continuing through 2024 and 2025 without having a crystal-clear, and effective strategy to promote its investment and business opportunities.

Host: Maxim, could you say a few words about the Paris Olympics? The whole world is now watching and commenting on the situation in the women's boxing category. What was the Last Supper about and now this in boxing? What is the message? Is this to promote liberal democracy or make it look bad? What do you see being communicated here?

Maxim: I am not a liberal democracy expert, much less an art specialist. I believe that the purpose of art is for everyone to express what they see and want to show, creating their messages so that some understand them and of course, some won't.

Host: As Oscar Wilde says, "All art is useless."

Maxim: Maybe, but I haven't heard that statement. We all go to the theater, or exhibitions, and many of them are meaningful. We also watch movies, of course. I don't think there should be any restrictions on art. That's what the scriptwriters of the Olympic opening ceremony decided. From a PR perspective, they brilliantly achieved their goal because the world is discussing this opening. Yes, there are opinions for and against, of course, but I support this type of debate because arguments can be heard from both sides.

Host: So, from a PR point of view, the goal is brilliantly achieved?

Maxim: In my opinion, yes.

Host: Sure, if everyone talks about Paris, what else is there to ask for?

Maxim: It's not just about talking. Everyone tries to discuss using reasonable arguments to be heard from both sides. And about whether men should box with women, I am the last person on the planet to have an opinion. But I think men should box with men. Personally, I find the discipline of women's boxing extremely extravagant.

Host: That's what I was going to ask – should women box at all?

Maxim: Why would women fight and lift weights? Why do they do things not typical for women in the way we understand them – ethereal and gentle?

Host: We will be accused of sexism.

Maxim: There is no sexism here. From what I saw in the last 2-3 days, the Boxing Federation and the International Olympic Committee are not responding adequately. Here, I touch on the communication side. I heard only general phrases and words from which one can't understand who a man is, who is a woman, and who is fighting whom. I think this problem was raised for good because it will be resolved, if not at this, then at the next Olympics.

Host: Maxim, thank you very much for this conversation.

Maxim: Thank you too!

 

Watch the full interview here.